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Jan 20, 2025
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Lily Kerhoas, a talented actress known for her roles in 'Les Misérables' and 'Phantom of the Opera', shares her inspiring journey from Paris to the West End, highlighting her determination, challenges like stage fright and COVID-19, and her growth as an artist.
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Lily Kerhoas, Les Misérables, Phantom of the Opera, West End, Theatre, Musical Theatre, Perseverance, Acting Career
Introduction to Lily Kerhoas
In this episode of the Five Minute Call podcast, hosts Oren Boder and Claire Underwood welcome the talented Lily Kerhoas. Known for her remarkable performances as Cosette in 'Les Misérables' and Christine in 'Phantom of the Opera', Lily's journey in the theatre world is both inspiring and enlightening. Her story is one of determination, passion, and resilience, making her a standout figure in the industry.
Early Beginnings
Lily's introduction to music and theatre began in Paris, where she was surrounded by a musically inclined family. Her mother, a classical singer, and her father's involvement in music set the stage for her artistic pursuits. Initially more interested in dance and gymnastics, Lily's path took a decisive turn when she saw 'Billy Elliot' in London at the age of 13, sparking her dream to perform on the West End.
The Journey to the West End
Lily's journey was marked by rigorous training and a clear vision. She balanced high school with a professional musical theatre program in Paris, all while honing her English skills and gaining stage experience. Her determination led her to the Royal Academy of Music in London, where she further developed her craft and eventually landed the role of Cosette in 'Les Misérables'.
Overcoming Challenges
Despite her successes, Lily faced numerous challenges, including stage fright and the pressure of performing in a foreign language. The onset of COVID-19 brought its own set of difficulties, as she navigated unemployment and the uncertainty of the industry. Yet, these obstacles only strengthened her resolve to pursue her dreams.
A New Chapter with 'Phantom of the Opera'
Lily's perseverance paid off when she secured the role of Christine in 'Phantom of the Opera', a testament to her hard work and dedication. This role not only represents a significant achievement in her career but also a personal victory, as she continues to challenge herself and grow as an artist.
Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Oren: Hello and welcome to The 5 Minute Call, the podcast that takes a deep dive into the stories of the [00:00:05] people that make theatre happen.
[00:00:06] Claire: In this episode, we're talking to Lili Kehoas.
[00:00:09] Oren: Lili has [00:00:10] studied in France, the UK and internationally, learning and evolving as a singer.
[00:00:14] Claire: [00:00:15] She's most recently played pivotal roles such as Cosette in Les Misérables and Christine in [00:00:20] Phantom of the Opera.[00:00:25]
[00:00:26] Announcer: Members of the company, this is your 5 Minute Call. [00:00:30] All beginners, please make your way to the stage. This is your 5 Minute Call. Your 5 [00:00:35] Minute Call.
[00:00:37] Claire: Hi Lily. Hi. Thank you for joining us [00:00:40] on the 5 Minute Call. Thank you for having me. Very lovely to have you here. Thank you so much. We [00:00:45] are fascinated to know your story as to how you got to where you are now.
[00:00:48] Claire: Can you tell us a little bit about [00:00:50] that? About all of it, like in one go? All of it start, like so, how does little [00:00:55] Lily get into singing?
[00:00:56] Lily: Oh, okay. Oh, that's cute. So [00:01:00] my mum is a singer. Um, my dad has always been in music. [00:01:05] He's been, he's not a musician professionally, but I've been around musical [00:01:10] theatre and, and singing and all of that, listening to my mum warming up every day.
[00:01:14] Lily: So for me, [00:01:15] it was very normal. Um, I'm from Paris, so, um, didn't speak English when [00:01:20] I was little, you know,
[00:01:21] Claire: And is she a classical singer?
[00:01:23] Lily: Yeah, she's more of a classical singer, but big [00:01:25] fan of musical theatre and like English American musical theatre. And [00:01:30] I actually was into dancing more or I was a gymnast as well when I was [00:01:35] little.
[00:01:35] Lily: So I was very physical and I loved the, all the dancey bit like, you know, [00:01:40] West Side Story, Singing in the Rain. I was a big fan of Gene Kelly. So I was more into that. [00:01:45] And my mom was like, do you want to? sing at some point. And I said, no, [00:01:50] no. Cause it looks really boring to warm up every day. Yeah. [00:01:55] So I actually, I was singing a lot, but as a hobby kind [00:02:00] of thing, not really thinking about it.
[00:02:02] Lily: And I think my first [00:02:05] singing actual singing lesson was when I was 16. So it's quite, it's not late, but [00:02:10] when I say that to people, they're like, Oh, okay. Like I wasn't in a choir. I wasn't, you [00:02:15] know, I didn't have that kind of thing. I was more like. [00:02:20] Um, so yeah, I started at 16 in, [00:02:25] um, in a school in Paris, like a musical theater, professional musical theater school, like a [00:02:30] three year program while I was doing, um, when I was doing [00:02:35] my high school as well at the same time.
[00:02:37] Lily: Um, and. I think [00:02:40] in my brain, what the moment that changed in terms of, Oh, I want to [00:02:45] be on stage was when I saw Billy Elliot [00:02:50] in London. Because I was 13. It was 13. So this, I [00:02:55] was the same age as the little boy. And I was like, I want to be him. Um, [00:03:00] so this crazy dream started when I was [00:03:05] 13 properly. Like I, I stepped out the theater and I said to my [00:03:10] parents, I want to do that.
[00:03:12] Lily: Uh, let's just, you know, look for schools [00:03:15] and, you know, so, um, so, but the actual like singing was. [00:03:20] It came a bit after.
[00:03:23] Oren: That's so decisive [00:03:25] though. It is. At 13. Yeah. That's what I want to
[00:03:27] Lily: do. Oh, my brain switched.
[00:03:28] Oren: What, what happened then between [00:03:30] 13 and 16?
[00:03:32] Lily: So I knew that I wanted to study [00:03:35] in London because I've always loved the, this city.
[00:03:38] Lily: Um, I [00:03:40] wanted to. Um, be on a Western stage because the standards and the [00:03:45] just it was incredible to see and I wasn't really seeing that in France [00:03:50] or Paris. It wasn't the same. It's not the same culture, basically. Um, so I knew in [00:03:55] my head, I was like, I know it's not gonna happen now because I'm 13. So [00:04:00] what I need to do is start to familiarize myself with [00:04:05] singing, dancing and and just, you know, um, knowing what the it is.
[00:04:09] Lily: plan would [00:04:10] be. So I thought I need to finish my, I think, middle [00:04:15] school, is it? Like, before high school here, how do you say? Is it middle school? Yeah, we don't have [00:04:20] that here. Oh, okay. Yeah, right before high school. So finished my, my, that, and then [00:04:25] I found this program where I could do the high school in the morning.
[00:04:29] Lily: And then, [00:04:30] And then a professional like musical theater school in the afternoon. It was two separate [00:04:35] things. So I was doing like two degrees at the same time because I'm very impatient. So I was like, [00:04:40] um, and then I thought, so I'm going to train. Like all the basic stuff in [00:04:45] Paris, uh, trying to learn English as much as I could and then, [00:04:50] um, worked in Paris because I needed experience.
[00:04:54] Lily: I was like, I [00:04:55] need to know how it feels to be on stage. And, and then I was preparing my [00:05:00] auditions for drama school and see what was possible. So at 13, I was like. [00:05:05] The plan is clear. I need to do this, this, this, this, this to be able to, to like [00:05:10] be in a drama school in, in London. And was there anybody guiding you in that?
[00:05:14] Lily: Oh, my parents, [00:05:15] definitely. Yeah. I'm an only child. So they were always very supportive of this dream and they [00:05:20] were like, I think they were very happy that I have found [00:05:25] a clear kind of understanding of what I wanted to do. [00:05:30] Um, and they were like, basically, if you want to be on a Western stage, you need to be in the [00:05:35] city.
[00:05:35] Lily: You need to learn from that, from them. Um, you can't stay in a comfort zone [00:05:40] in your Parisian flat, just dreaming of and, you know, looking at YouTube or [00:05:45] whatever you need to do. And, um, so I've always felt [00:05:50] an amazing. space for me to dream [00:05:55] big with my parents, um, but also. They were like, but [00:06:00] this is your thing.
[00:06:01] Lily: You have to figure it out on your own. We can support you financially. We can, [00:06:05] you know, guide you, all of that, but this is your thing. You have to make it your own, [00:06:10] basically. Um, so, and there's one thing that I remember [00:06:15] from my dad. He said, um, you know, when you have like a bit of doubts and it was, you know, it's [00:06:20] hard.
[00:06:20] Lily: You have obstacles and stuff. So I was talking to him and he said to me, the thing is, if [00:06:25] you dream of Gin Kelly, you have [00:06:30] to aim for it. Aim for Gene Kelly, and you'll see, because I was a big fan of [00:06:35] that, so you'll see, don't like, don't restrict yourself, basically. [00:06:40] Amazing. Yeah, so I think it gave me a lot of like, energy.
[00:06:44] Lily: I knew they [00:06:45] were here, but I was very, I've always been a very determined, [00:06:50] decisive. Kid, so an ambitious, so that [00:06:55] helped a lot to not like, I was very, this is my, I need to do this. Yeah. [00:07:00] So yeah.
[00:07:01] Claire: And how was it practicing at home? I [00:07:05] asked that with some level of, um, personal curiosity. I had, [00:07:10] um, musician parents and I found it very difficult to.
[00:07:12] Claire: practice so that
[00:07:13] Lily: they like when you do [00:07:15] like if they hear you or something oh i was i hate it
[00:07:18] Claire: yeah i
[00:07:18] Lily: hated it i [00:07:20] i remember before going into musical theater school like training in paris [00:07:25] i i was singing in my bedroom but like Very [00:07:30] quietly. So I had like my earphones and I was like, thinking[00:07:35]
[00:07:36] Lily: that they wouldn't, they wouldn't, you know, so when I came [00:07:40] into musical theater school, I had a tiny voice because I've never like [00:07:45] experienced kind of singing. But I remember that when we were [00:07:50] having like family gatherings or something like that. Um, yeah. My dad was like, do [00:07:55] you want to play us something on a piano and sing something like, you know, when, when they're [00:08:00] like, Oh, sing, sing.
[00:08:01] Lily: And I was like, yeah, sure. And my dad [00:08:05] remembers that he's like, that was very like quick and, and you [00:08:10] were fearless. And I think I just wanted I've always wanted to [00:08:15] challenge myself. And so it was a good thing to do as well. But practicing, [00:08:20] I have to say I was a bit self conscious. So I, I, I think I waited to [00:08:25] be at school to do that, to be honest.
[00:08:27] Lily: Also, like my mom being a singer, like it's, [00:08:30] she would never judge anything because we have very different voices, but it's weird. [00:08:35] It's just weird. You
[00:08:35] Claire: just know that they know is the problem. Yeah. And I didn't want to do like
[00:08:39] Lily: the same [00:08:40] exercises that she was doing. But again, I was more into the dance. stuff before.[00:08:45]
[00:08:45] Lily: So in my head I was like, no, I'm not a singer. Oh no, I can, I can sing like, I can do, [00:08:50] you know, but I'm not, I'm not a singer. I wanted to be like, you know, in the [00:08:55] ensemble. Yeah. But I think I never wanted to be an ensemble, but [00:09:00] maybe it was my way of like, you know, kind of starting slow. [00:09:05] Yeah. Taking the pressure off it.
[00:09:06] Lily: Maybe, maybe.
[00:09:07] Oren: When did you make that decision [00:09:10] then that I want to be a singer? Is that when you turned 16, or is it beyond that?
[00:09:14] Lily: So it [00:09:15] was, so I did my first year when I was 16, started at 16. And then [00:09:20] During the summer, um, I went into a musical [00:09:25] theatre camp thing, um, in the UK. I think it [00:09:30] was, I don't remember where, it was in the middle of nowhere.
[00:09:32] Lily: And we had like, it was fun, it was like we had [00:09:35] lessons, we had little performances like this. And there were a singing, there was a singing competition [00:09:40] at the end of it. And, um, I was hanging out with, I think the medical [00:09:45] staff of the thing. And we were like messing around and just singing. And I [00:09:50] sang.
[00:09:50] Lily: Something, I don't remember what, and she was like [00:09:55] You have to do the competition. I was like, no, no, no, no, no, I'm not. And I was like, [00:10:00] okay, well, I love a challenge. Let's try. And I won, I won the competition. And [00:10:05] I think that's why I was like, I think I've, I've always known that I [00:10:10] had a voice, but never kind of, I think I was a bit [00:10:15] afraid of, I knew how hard it was.
[00:10:18] Lily: So I was a bit afraid to like, take the [00:10:20] step. And from, from then coming back to my second year, [00:10:25] I. I think I, I, I tried a bit more to, to [00:10:30] have my voice heard, um, and [00:10:35] it wasn't easy because it was, I think it was quite progressive. It wasn't like, [00:10:40] Oh, I need to be, I want to be a singer. It was like, Oh, that works.
[00:10:43] Lily: Oh, that, that has a [00:10:45] good response or that, you know? Um, and then I think it was, yeah, it was like a, [00:10:50] a long process for me to be like, Oh, actually. [00:10:55] That can, that can work. And then I hurt my knee so I couldn't dance. [00:11:00]
[00:11:00] Claire: I was just going to say, did that mean that the singing came up to the same level as the dancing?
[00:11:03] Claire: The
[00:11:04] Lily: singing, the [00:11:05] singing did that. Basically, and the, you know, kind of.
[00:11:08] Claire: Right.
[00:11:08] Oren: But yeah,
[00:11:09] Lily: yeah.
[00:11:09] Oren: [00:11:10] If you hadn't had that moment of validation, if that, if you didn't do that [00:11:15] competition, and you didn't win it, do you think you'd be singing? I don't know. I
[00:11:18] Lily: have no idea. I think I, [00:11:20] probably, yeah. Because it was always, in me, I [00:11:25] think.
[00:11:25] Lily: Um, but that, that idea of having validation definitely pushed me [00:11:30] to be like, okay, I need to stop being ridiculous and I need to explore that. [00:11:35] So it was the beginning of like, exploring that voice. It wasn't easy because I wasn't the [00:11:40] best at it. Um, but I think my teachers always felt that something [00:11:45] was there that needed to be explored basically.
[00:11:49] Lily: But I [00:11:50] think I, yeah, I would have. probably at some point, but [00:11:55] definitely the validation was important.
[00:11:58] Claire: It is, especially that age. [00:12:00] I think you need some reassurance that you're not going to go out there and make a complete fool of [00:12:05] yourself, right? To have that moment of
[00:12:08] Lily: Yeah. Also, I was in that course, I was [00:12:10] the youngest one.
[00:12:10] Lily: I was with, I was 16 and people were 25 to 30. [00:12:15] Wow. And did you know that going into it? Mm hmm. You're very
[00:12:19] Claire: brave, young lady. [00:12:20]
[00:12:21] Lily: I was like, doing my like, A levels. Yeah, yeah. [00:12:25] Um, at the same time, yeah, going into, yeah, it [00:12:30] was, it was, it was huge. Three years of a lot of, of work and a lot of [00:12:35] social difficulties as well because of that.
[00:12:39] Lily: Um, because [00:12:40] of, because of the difference and I was very also like very [00:12:45] determined to improve and I think [00:12:50] people were a bit, I would say jealous, but like, they were like, who's, who's [00:12:55] that?
[00:12:55] Claire: A little bit wary.
[00:12:56] Lily: Yeah. They were like, I mean. [00:13:00] You know, why are you working so hard? Why are you [00:13:05] like staying at the end of the day stretching or like doing your exercise like there were a bit more [00:13:10] I don't know.
[00:13:10] Lily: Maybe it's maybe it's because I was younger. I was like I need to to [00:13:15] be in the same at the same level in terms of like not [00:13:20] just artistically, but just to fit in but I didn't [00:13:25] fit like I it's not possible Because they were like, why are you not like hanging out [00:13:30] with us? And I'm 16 and I have school in the morning [00:13:35] and I'm not here to make friends.
[00:13:36] Lily: I don't really care. Um, and they were like, that's, that's [00:13:40] rude. Sorry. I have, it's too big of a dream to [00:13:45] be worrying about you and about your feelings. [00:13:50] I learned a lot in terms of like who I was and it was, it was difficult sometimes, but [00:13:55] it was, it was, yeah, it was definitely, it, It made [00:14:00] me stronger.
[00:14:01] Claire: And were you also, was that balanced out at school or in [00:14:05] terms of social, or were you also kind of for fish out of water there because of what you were doing elsewhere
[00:14:09] Lily: [00:14:10] in high school?
[00:14:10] Lily: Yeah, it was a, like a specialized high school for that. So we had like [00:14:15] dancers from the conservatoire, we had, um, musicians, um, also, uh, [00:14:20] like there's a sports section. Okay. So we were all in the same thing. So I [00:14:25] was fitting in then. Uh, in this place, which was really nice. And then everybody in the [00:14:30] afternoon would do their thing basically.
[00:14:32] Lily: So yeah, we just had five [00:14:35] hours of each day of high school to, with the same program. So it was a lot of [00:14:40] work on top of the other degree.
[00:14:43] Oren: That's intense. It's [00:14:45] really intense. Do you look back, are
[00:14:47] Claire: you, are you surprised looking back, [00:14:50] you know, when you process that, does it seem surprising that you managed that?
[00:14:54] Claire: Or does that just [00:14:55] seem like, no, that was me. That was.
[00:14:56] Lily: No, that was me. That was me. [00:15:00] Um, it was definitely a struggle because I hated high school because I [00:15:05] had that comparison of doing what I was, what I loved, but [00:15:10] it got me there. It got me here. So I'm like, I know. No. And I [00:15:15] think the amount of work I can take now is also thanks to that.
[00:15:19] Lily: [00:15:20] It's thanks to, to being in an intense kind of, and [00:15:25] also like fighting for what you want. It's that idea of like, I know what it feels like. I know that [00:15:30] it can work out. I know that this is what you have to do, you know, to, so [00:15:35] I think it was, it was me. Yeah. I could have been like, yeah, I didn't want to [00:15:40] wait.
[00:15:41] Lily: Time. Orientation. [00:15:45]
[00:15:45] Claire: Yeah. And did you have opportunity to perform through that time? During
[00:15:49] Lily: [00:15:50] my training? During those studies?
[00:15:51] Claire: Were you doing
[00:15:51] Lily: any? I was, I was doing like, I was doing [00:15:55] open mics. Like, um, to meet people in the industry in Paris, [00:16:00] because I was like, I need to network. I was a businesswoman at [00:16:05] like 17, 18, but, like, I, I, I knew that I needed to [00:16:10] challenge myself, even though I was super nervous to sing, you know, [00:16:15] give my sheet music to a pianist and sing in front of industry people.
[00:16:19] Lily: [00:16:20] But I think that's what people saw, they were like, okay, she's fine. 18 and she's just doing [00:16:25] it and, you know, and I, the more I could do that, the more I could feel confident and then [00:16:30] having feedback, knowing what works, what didn't work and what I could work on [00:16:35] to, to be better, you know what I mean, to be better, to grow.
[00:16:39] Lily: Yeah. [00:16:40] Yeah.
[00:16:42] Oren: And at this stage, you're still not working with a teacher, right? [00:16:45] Like privately.
[00:16:45] Lily: No, no. Yeah, no, I wasn't. It was just in the school.
[00:16:48] Oren: So all the feedback you're [00:16:50] getting. outside of the school environment is from those kind of sessions.
[00:16:54] Lily: Yeah, [00:16:55] it's more like people that are working or that are also in schools, [00:17:00] but it's Yeah, industry people that you will meet, you know, in the [00:17:05] future and shows and stuff.
[00:17:06] Lily: Yeah, definitely. So
[00:17:07] Claire: what happens after that course? Were [00:17:10] you 19 by then or?
[00:17:11] Lily: I was 18. 18. My first thing I did a [00:17:15] concert in New York with Conor and Gregor. They're composers, American composers. Okay. [00:17:20] Um, it was my first kind of professional thing, uh, which was amazing. So I [00:17:25] was with. Americans, no friend. I mean, it was the [00:17:30] first time I had to speak English, you know, with people.[00:17:35]
[00:17:35] Lily: Um, so it was really, really cool. Um, and [00:17:40] then I auditioned for any kind of like everything I could [00:17:45] Possibly fine, like the, in Paris, the, you know, children's shows, plays. [00:17:50] I did an acting degree after that, just one year, just straight acting. [00:17:55] Um, and on, on top of that, I was working in, like, little things that you're not paid [00:18:00] for.
[00:18:00] Lily: Like, you know, all of those things. Because I was like, I need to now experience and I need to [00:18:05] meet people and all. Yeah, and then getting ready to Do [00:18:10] those auditions for drama school in the UK, but then I did Greece in Paris [00:18:15] That was my first kind of big contract with stage entertainment [00:18:20] It was a year contract and I was like, oh, that's actually good because I [00:18:25] can save money because I know London is very expensive I was like, that's a great way to [00:18:30] save money to have experience.
[00:18:31] Lily: I was under studying covering Sandy Um, I was a dancer [00:18:35] in the, in the ensemble. Um, it's good for the CV as well. So. [00:18:40] And did you,
[00:18:41] Claire: did you have an agent in France? Or are you doing that all self propelled?
[00:18:44] Lily: [00:18:45] Yes. It's in France. It's not really, you can have an agent, but it doesn't work the same way. We don't have [00:18:50] enough shows basically to.
[00:18:53] Lily: It's not, it's not [00:18:55] useful. For screen you do, but not for theatre. It's more about who you [00:19:00] know and you go online and see the castings and like the, you know, the stuff like that. Yeah. [00:19:05]
[00:19:05] Oren: There's a moment in time here that I feel like I want to clarify. So you've been in, you [00:19:10] live in Paris, working in Paris, training in Paris.
[00:19:13] Oren: Are you working with your American [00:19:15] composers in Paris or in New York?
[00:19:16] Lily: It was just a week. A week of, of [00:19:20] like rehearsals and then a concert in New York. [00:19:25] Yeah. That's pretty cool. That's pretty cool. And that was like, [00:19:30] it was because of the open mics. So basically there were, they did a concert, [00:19:35] like the first part of the evening was a concert of like new music.[00:19:40]
[00:19:40] Lily: Um, and then there was an open mic. So that's also why I went because I knew that some [00:19:45] composers were So I was like, she is a businesswoman. [00:19:50] I am! She is!
[00:19:52] Oren: Absolutely is.
[00:19:54] Lily: And [00:19:55] I think that's why, you know, it kind of,
[00:19:57] Oren: yeah. Were you always [00:20:00] okay with traveling, going places and exploring new cultures and getting into it?
[00:20:04] Lily: It was [00:20:05] really new. But, I've always known that I wanted to come to London, definitely. [00:20:10] New York was chaotic. I mean it's a, it's a lot. [00:20:15] Uh, I was a bit, oh God, with Americans and I was, you know, it's, it's, it was, it was [00:20:20] very, it was hard, but any kind of like [00:20:25] hard thing that I went through, I knew it was beneficial because I [00:20:30] came out stronger.
[00:20:30] Lily: I was like, if I can do that, I'm capable of anything. So I always had that [00:20:35] perspective of like, even when I get a no from an audition, I'm like, It makes [00:20:40] me want to work harder for the next one. That kind of, like, mindset. I've always had that kind of [00:20:45] mindset. Um, so, so yeah, it was, it was pretty hectic. [00:20:50] But I, I, I haven't, I've never toured.
[00:20:54] Lily: [00:20:55] I've never done something like that. But yeah, I just knew that I wanted to come to London. [00:21:00] Definitely. So you finish Greece? Yeah. During Greece [00:21:05] I auditioned for a few schools. Yeah. Uh, and I got [00:21:10] into Royal Academy of Music. I got into Arts Ed first, [00:21:15] and that was, that's interesting because, so RAM is, Royal Academy is [00:21:20] one year, it's a master's degree, and Arts Ed is a BA, so it's three, three [00:21:25] years, and I've always loved RAM, [00:21:30] um, for some reason, um, but getting into Arts Ed I was [00:21:35] like, I need more training because I will need to work on my English, [00:21:40] and I, and it was three years, and I was like, if it's three years, [00:21:45] I'll be stronger.
[00:21:46] Lily: So I wasn't confident enough to just do one year. [00:21:50] So I declined RAM. Daniel Bowling called me, who's the [00:21:55] head of Department of Musical Theatre. And he was like, What are you doing, Lily? [00:22:00] And I said, I'm, I just need more time to feel that I'm ready. And he [00:22:05] was like, That doesn't mean, that, that doesn't make sense.
[00:22:08] Lily: You're, [00:22:10] you're, you're fine. And I was like, but I'm not, I'm not from here. I have so much to learn. And he was [00:22:15] like, no, no, no. I want you to come here. And I was like, okay, um, [00:22:20] and it was interesting because I wasn't confident enough to, to follow what I really [00:22:25] wanted. It's like, no, I need more time. I need more time.
[00:22:27] Lily: Yeah. And that was out of like fear. [00:22:30]
[00:22:30] Claire: That sounds very out of character.
[00:22:31] Oren: Yeah. Yeah. It's gonna say.
[00:22:32] Claire: Yeah. Definitely. Just a little [00:22:35] moment of doubt. Yeah, of doubt of
[00:22:37] Lily: being like, Oh, I need more, you [00:22:40] know, because I love training as well.
[00:22:42] Claire: Yeah,
[00:22:42] Lily: I love training because also it's safe. [00:22:45] So it's a comfort zone for me.
[00:22:47] Lily: Um, and Dan was like, [00:22:50] well, you'll meet agents, you'll meet people. And I was like, yeah, that's what I need. I need. [00:22:55] That's the next step. Um, and then so got into RAM in 2018. [00:23:00] When I was 21, yeah, I just turned 21.
[00:23:04] Oren: How long was [00:23:05] RAM?
[00:23:05] Lily: It was a year. Yeah. A bit less than a year of like, uh, just one, yeah, master's degree.[00:23:10]
[00:23:10] Lily: Very intense. Very intense. It was amazing though. It was [00:23:15] really
[00:23:15] Claire: cool. It's an amazing school. And, and how was it dealing with [00:23:20] English in such a short space of time? And
[00:23:22] Lily: at that point I was more confident about my English because I [00:23:25] worked. So to work on my drama school auditions, I, cause I had to do Shakespeare and like [00:23:30] monologues and all of that.
[00:23:31] Lily: So I worked with, um, a coach who is [00:23:35] French, but who went to drama school in London. So he, he knew everything about [00:23:40] auditions and English and all of that. So for a year, every week I had two hours [00:23:45] of coachings Shakespeare and monologue rep, uh, did a [00:23:50] lot of like masterclasses with English people. So I was [00:23:55] more confident with my English.
[00:23:57] Lily: And I was also, my [00:24:00] brain was like, I need to, to learn, I need to push myself [00:24:05] and to make mistakes as well. If I don't understand something, I'll just raise my [00:24:10] hand. I was like, what does that word mean? And you did. Productions or [00:24:15] showcases? Yeah, we had showcase for the agents and then a christmas concert. [00:24:20] Um Always directed by, uh, people from [00:24:25] outside, which was amazing to meet them.
[00:24:27] Lily: And then we, I did the wild [00:24:30] party at the end of the year. Um, and I played Queenie. [00:24:35] Um, which was Why does that make you laugh? Because she's normally 40. Yeah. [00:24:40] Um, but it was, it was really cool. Um, we had [00:24:45] a lot of, uh, creative projects. I did Merrily We Roll Along. Um, a [00:24:50] cabaret type of thing.
[00:24:50] Claire: Yeah. Very creative, of course.
[00:24:53] Claire: You come out of the end of that [00:24:55] with an agent saying, hello world, here I am. Yes,
[00:24:58] Lily: yes. From my [00:25:00] showcase, which was very lucky. At this point, I didn't know if I wanted to come back [00:25:05] to, I felt a bit homesick. And it was [00:25:10] scary to be like, okay now I'm done. It seems to be a very hard [00:25:15] industry. Um, and got the [00:25:20] agent and then even in RAM we were doing auditions, professional auditions.[00:25:25]
[00:25:25] Lily: Um, that's where our audition for Lim is. Okay. Um. [00:25:30] And we were actually doing The Wild Party at the same time in rehearsals, so I [00:25:35] was going to the audition room, back to tech rehearsals and all of that, and [00:25:40] I auditioned for Cosette, which is a soprano part. Queenie is an alto [00:25:45] who smokes. So, it was very, um, a big stretch.
[00:25:49] Lily: [00:25:50] Um, and I really didn't think anything, like, the audition for Cosette, I was like [00:25:55] It's me, but I, I don't know. It was very, [00:26:00] yeah. And then, right before I go on stage for Queenie, Um, [00:26:05] our company manager in school was like, Oh, you got it. I was like, what? And she [00:26:10] was like, they offered you the concert version of Les Mis.
[00:26:14] Lily: [00:26:15] And I was like, um, like, understudy? She's like, no, no. [00:26:20] No, no, no, no. I was so out of it. I was like, [00:26:25] I don't understand what you're saying to me. And so, and so [00:26:30] that's how it kind of started. Yeah. So I was employed before finishing.
[00:26:34] Oren: [00:26:35] And then you had to go on stage and perform.
[00:26:36] Lily: Yeah. I was like,
[00:26:38] Oren: nice.
[00:26:39] Lily: [00:26:40] Welcome to my part.
[00:26:40] Oren: I
[00:26:44] Lily: [00:26:45] think what I did was like, I will put that aside for a sec and I'll focus [00:26:50] on what I need to do. Um, and, and then [00:26:55] processed. I don't think I've ever processed it. Honest. It's kind of [00:27:00] a blur, but
[00:27:00] Claire: yeah. Well, it's hard to know how to. Process that, isn't it? I mean, [00:27:05] no, because yeah, you just got to put the next foot in front of you.
[00:27:08] Claire: And
[00:27:09] Lily: yeah. [00:27:10] And they were like, it's amazing. Cause you're going to work with Alfie Bow, Matt Lucas, Michael [00:27:15] Bull. I was like, I don't know who those people are. I am not from here. Who are they? I don't [00:27:20] know. And I think it was a blessing because yeah. Yeah. Um, but yeah. [00:27:25] Yeah, it was, it was, it was something. It was very surreal.
[00:27:29] Lily: Very surreal.
[00:27:29] Claire: [00:27:30] Okay, so let's dive into that, if we may. Interesting bit. So, [00:27:35] it's all interesting. What are you talking about? This episode is sponsored [00:27:40] by Vocality, a specially formulated blend of tea for professional voice users. [00:27:45] Each ingredient has been carefully selected to help you soothe and take care of your [00:27:50] voice.
[00:27:50] Claire: The tea is naturally caffeine free, suitable for vegans, and does not contain [00:27:55] any artificial flavours or colours. Vocalitea is the secret to vocal clarity in a [00:28:00] cup. So tell us, showing up for first day of rehearsal, how's that? [00:28:05]
[00:28:05] Lily: So
[00:28:07] Claire: we had a
[00:28:08] Lily: meet and greet. I hate [00:28:10] those so much. I hate it, uh, because I, [00:28:15] I was no one, like everybody was [00:28:20] someone, do you know what I mean?
[00:28:21] Lily: In the industry. And I was like, I'm s I would, I had that thing [00:28:25] of like, I'm sorry to be here. I don't know. But it's, it's, [00:28:30] that's the thing. It's very natural and very human, I think. But, and also in, in the room, [00:28:35] even the ensemble, they all done the show before. I didn't know the words. [00:28:40] Even previews, I didn't know the words.
[00:28:42] Lily: I was like, at the end of the day, it was still I don't know. [00:28:45] Because it was two weeks of rehearsals. So we did a, like, a [00:28:50] run a run through of just the music. Singing in front of everyone. And I was just like, [00:28:55] oh! And I think my, I was like, I need to dissociate. I need to [00:29:00] dissociate. I need to just be the actress.
[00:29:03] Lily: And my feelings are there. [00:29:05] And I'll deal with them afterwards. I just need to do it and get through it. And [00:29:10] then You know, but I was very shy. I was very shy. Um, it was, it was hard [00:29:15] to know who I was in the room. Um, everybody knew each other, everybody, you know, so, [00:29:20] but I think I learned a lot about myself. [00:29:25] Um, this contract was, was incredible in a lot of ways [00:29:30] because we did the album and the cinema release and all of that.
[00:29:34] Lily: The [00:29:35] most stressful day of my life. It was so, so stressful. Um, [00:29:40] but It was, I think socially it was hard. [00:29:45] Artistically, I think I found my groove [00:29:50] at some point because I was like, Oh, I know how to sing the role. It's, [00:29:55] it, they trust me, so I, you know.
[00:29:57] Claire: Yeah.
[00:29:57] Lily: But it was more socially, because it was [00:30:00] different culture.
[00:30:01] Lily: Yeah. Yeah, people that was, [00:30:05] that were already established. So I, I was very [00:30:10] quiet, not myself.
[00:30:11] Oren: Did you feel like an outsider?
[00:30:12] Lily: Oh yeah, absolutely.
[00:30:14] Oren: Feels [00:30:15] reminiscent of how you were saying when you were back at camp.
[00:30:18] Lily: Always. I was a new one, [00:30:20] the young one. Um. I've always been that. Uh, it's [00:30:25] starting to change a bit, but it got the pressure off a bit as [00:30:30] well to be like, you're the new one, you're, you know, but I think being in this room, I was like, I need, [00:30:35] I need to, to find myself as a [00:30:40] performer.
[00:30:40] Lily: Um, and also as a human being in this country, in this language, [00:30:45] in this. So you try, you try to adjust to everyone. You try to, you want everyone to, [00:30:50] To like you and to fit in and all of that. And it's a lot of [00:30:55] energy, but I think you have to go through that in the beginning of your career. It's, it's, it's inevitable, [00:31:00] I think.
[00:31:01] Lily: Um, but after that, I [00:31:05] continued with the Lemon Journey. We opened with the Sondheim at the Sometime Theater, [00:31:10] with the stage version and with John Robbins. Um, and, [00:31:15] um, we. I think I felt, I knew a bit more [00:31:20] what I was doing and I had a lot of, um, you know, social media [00:31:25] presence, um, with the concert, a lot of followers and that gave me a lot of anxiety as [00:31:30] well, it was very, it was a lot at once.
[00:31:34] Lily: So I was kind of [00:31:35] like following, I wasn't in control really of what I was doing, [00:31:40] um, and And it [00:31:45] was hard at some point because I developed a lot of stage fright [00:31:50] with Cosette because I don't have a lot to do in the show, [00:31:55] so I was waiting a lot. And, um, and so I developed a lot of, like, [00:32:00] doubts of, gosh, can I do this?
[00:32:04] Lily: Am I capable? [00:32:05] And how did you deal with that going on stage? Um, [00:32:10] COVID. COVID. Um, the problem went
[00:32:12] Claire: away.
[00:32:12] Lily: Well, I, I think what I needed to [00:32:15] do before every show or before my entrance, I had to do my [00:32:20] lyrics in the corner, just doing my lyrics again. Um, [00:32:25] I wasn't worried about my voice really, but more about [00:32:30] my capabilities as a performer being on stage in front of people.
[00:32:34] Lily: Um, [00:32:35] and Also, to have people in front of you that just assumes that you know what you're [00:32:40] doing. So I like fake it till we make it a bit, [00:32:45] um, I talked a lot with, well, actually with John who was, you know, [00:32:50] he's, he's got a long career, so it's, it's always nice to have wise words [00:32:55] from someone like this. Um, but I, [00:33:00] I just wanted to go home.
[00:33:02] Lily: I was very homesick and then COVID [00:33:05] happened and it was. a blessing for me at first. [00:33:10] Um, because I could release a bit because I had no time between drama school [00:33:15] and then Les Mis. I had costume fittings during [00:33:20] graduation, like during, before I graduated. So I had no moments of, [00:33:25] which I'm grateful for, but it was, it was
[00:33:29] Oren: Yeah, [00:33:30] it seems like there was no time to stop and reconcile the knowledge that you'd been getting from your [00:33:35] training and then
[00:33:35] Lily: no and everybody's like It's a it's amazing.
[00:33:38] Lily: You're becoming this and your [00:33:40] career is you know, it's and I'm like, yeah, I can't complain I need to I need to [00:33:45] to do it, but it was it was very um exposing Yeah, definitely. And
[00:33:49] Claire: [00:33:50] I suppose maybe a moment of coming face to face with your dream, like you dreamed it and now you're doing it. [00:33:55] Yeah, it's happening.
[00:33:55] Lily: Yeah. So I had also that moment of like, I'm so proud and I could see that in my [00:34:00] parents eyes, but not in myself. Because I was like, [00:34:05] it feels It feels very, like, sometimes it feels like a [00:34:10] struggle, um, to adjust to everything and to everyone. [00:34:15] Um, and at the same time, I'm like, you know, tick the [00:34:20] box. Uh, but I always felt that it was the beginning of [00:34:25] something and not an achievement.
[00:34:27] Lily: Because I'm always like, oh, it's not enough. I want [00:34:30] more. Um, and um, and [00:34:35] So I thought, now the work starts, I've done the prep for [00:34:40] from 13 to now, that's just prep work. Now the work starts. [00:34:45] I'm not like, Oh, I'm in a West End show. Never, never. And I felt [00:34:50] that opening that I was like, Oh, okay, this is what it feels like.[00:34:55]
[00:34:56] Lily: Yeah.
[00:34:57] Claire: Did you ever doubt what you'd wanted all that [00:35:00] time?
[00:35:00] Lily: No, never. That was the one thing that was, that sticked with me, never. [00:35:05] All the doubt, the amount of doubts or fear that I had, I was like, I [00:35:10] know it's normal, but I, the promise that I made to [00:35:15] myself is still there.
[00:35:16] Oren: Do you live for the work and the [00:35:20] journey or the response from the audience?
[00:35:22] Lily: Oh. [00:35:25] Um, I think there's a bit of both. I love the journey of it. I love it because [00:35:30] it's, it's so connected to my [00:35:35] deepest self that I always feel so [00:35:40] truthful when I work on my craft and all of that, you know, and I just love it [00:35:45] as well. Um, but I think [00:35:50] there is also a level of wanting the attention. Um. [00:35:55] And now I feel like it's changing a bit.
[00:35:59] Lily: I don't [00:36:00] look at, you know, comments on whatever performance I [00:36:05] did. I don't like looking at myself. I'm just focusing on the feeling I [00:36:10] had on stage. Um, because I think. During Les [00:36:15] Mis, I was more worried about what people would think, because you need that [00:36:20] validation. Um, and I think that's, it's, it's something that [00:36:25] is part of us for any kind of job, I guess.
[00:36:27] Lily: Um, and the more I have experience, [00:36:30] the more I can trust that some stuff are enough, and I don't really need [00:36:35] the validation of certain people, because I found it in myself. Um, [00:36:40] And the fact that going through COVID, being unemployed for three years [00:36:45] with a lot of trauma, um, the fact that I'm, that I [00:36:50] kept going means that it's not just about the attention.
[00:36:53] Lily: It's about just [00:36:55] something that was missing. So I think it depends on your mental [00:37:00] health, I guess. It kind of like varies, but I'm always very conscious of that. [00:37:05] Because it's never coming from a good place for me if it's just for the attention because I don't [00:37:10] perform well when I do that.
[00:37:13] Claire: Yeah. [00:37:15] So three years of COVID not performing at all.
[00:37:17] Lily: Yeah. So I went back to [00:37:20] France, went back to my boyfriend at the time because we were long distance. [00:37:25] Um, and it was very nice to kind of chill. Um, [00:37:30] and then there was this talk of [00:37:35] doing. the concert of Les Mis again at Christmas. Um, and [00:37:40] then we had Zoom meetings about reopening the Sondheim. You know, that was ongoing, [00:37:45] I guess, for every cast.
[00:37:47] Lily: Um, and [00:37:50] basically, they didn't ask me back. [00:37:55] So it was, it was really, that was the trauma that I, I was like, [00:38:00] why? Um, so I kind of spent [00:38:05] the whole of COVID trying to figure out. [00:38:10] So I basically lost, lost my job, um, and still [00:38:15] had my agent, but it was very, really difficult times because [00:38:20] all of the shows were on and then closing again.
[00:38:23] Lily: And, and all the [00:38:25] cast in the shows were staying on because of the security, but I wasn't asked [00:38:30] back. So I started to teach singing as everybody did [00:38:35] on zoom, uh, which actually was. It's really [00:38:40] good. I learned a lot from that. And it made me really think about more [00:38:45] on the mental health side of things as well.
[00:38:48] Lily: Um, [00:38:50] and it really helped me to stay connected to singing in some way. I did a few concerts as a [00:38:55] guest here and there, but Went back to London at some [00:39:00] point to actually be in the city and try to audition, but I was a [00:39:05] struggling actress For whom before everything could have worked out [00:39:10] from 13 to now to then And now it was the [00:39:15] first time that I really felt that I was fighting for it, which was an incredible [00:39:20] feeling It was very painful, but it was an incredible feeling to actually [00:39:25] To feel like you're fighting for something you want and you're not giving up as painful [00:39:30] at it as it is.
[00:39:31] Lily: Sorry. Um, so, [00:39:35] so yeah, singing, teaching. I was a nanny for two weeks. [00:39:40] Um, didn't last long. All the, you know, I was doing [00:39:45] auditions, going to finals, you know, not hearing back, seeing the cast [00:39:50] announced on social media. All of those things kind of, you know, they, they [00:39:55] traumatize you. Yeah. Yeah. Um, and [00:40:00] then I got out of that at some point, but yeah, that was mostly teaching.
[00:40:04] Lily: I [00:40:05]
[00:40:05] Claire: think it's really important to acknowledge that I think there's a [00:40:10] perception, especially when you're younger, that you do all the study and you go through and then you bag your first [00:40:15] role and then it's like the rollercoaster from there. Hopefully the roles just get bigger and bigger and you go,
[00:40:19] Lily: yeah,
[00:40:19] Claire: [00:40:20] but actually the reality is it's one role and then it's nothing for [00:40:25] ages if, if the right thing doesn't.
[00:40:27] Claire: Come along and you're not in the right place at the right time or that, you [00:40:30] know, and it's all
[00:40:30] Lily: about choices to me because during that time I, I re auditioned for Les Mis, [00:40:35] but for Fontaine. Um, and. And I went through [00:40:40] a few rounds, and before the finals they were like, We want to see you for the finals, but it would be for [00:40:45] cover because you're a bit young.
[00:40:46] Lily: And I was like, I, I understand that, but I've done the [00:40:50] show as a role, and I don't want to be in the ensemble of MMS. And at talking [00:40:55] to my agent she was like, I know it's hard with the ambition that you have [00:41:00] because you have a choice of going a certain direction and say yes to [00:41:05] every kind of job or choose to struggle a bit more for hoping for something [00:41:10] better.
[00:41:10] Lily: So it's all about trusting your abilities and trusting the dream [00:41:15] that you had at the beginning. And, and for me, that's fighting for it. It's fighting is saying no to certain [00:41:20] things. So I said, I appreciate it. No, thank you. Because I, [00:41:25] I wouldn't be happy. I'd rather struggle a bit more. I've done it for three years, I can [00:41:30] wait a bit more.
[00:41:31] Lily: Um, so I think it's about having the strength of knowing what [00:41:35] you want and believing that it will happen. And that's the biggest [00:41:40] strength you can have. It's the bravest thing you can do, in my opinion, for yourself. [00:41:45] Because if I would've said yes, I would've [00:41:50] disappoint the kid in me. I would've Break the promise I made [00:41:55] as a kid of you're gonna fight for Gene Kelly, you know [00:42:00] Yeah, it didn't make sense.
[00:42:02] Lily: And my dad has always been like money is money is [00:42:05] material, you know it's it's it's it's a real struggle, you know, [00:42:10] but What's more important
[00:42:13] Oren: to ever talk to your younger self [00:42:15]
[00:42:15] Lily: all the time? I write a lot. I write every day And recently I was [00:42:20] like, I feel like I've achieved what I wanted. [00:42:25] And it feels so, I feel so free [00:42:30] from it.
[00:42:31] Lily: And I, I just feel so I just see her [00:42:35] smiling all the time, which is, which is really good. Whatever struggle, like, whatever [00:42:40] the things I'm going through at the moment as well, in like mental health and [00:42:45] anxiety, it's, it's there. But [00:42:50] if my younger self is, is like, good job, well done, we've done it, [00:42:55] I'm, I'm like, that's enough.
[00:42:57] Lily: I can go through anything, you know, because it's [00:43:00] it's it's She's my light basically and it's it's so important [00:43:05] to take care of it.
[00:43:08] Claire: It's very beautiful[00:43:10]
[00:43:14] Oren: We'll get [00:43:15] back to the episode in just a minute But I just wanted to quickly say that 75 percent of you are not [00:43:20] subscribed to this channel So if you could Hit that subscribe button, like this video [00:43:25] and ding the bell for notifications so you never miss an episode in the future. [00:43:30]
[00:43:30] Claire: So we better tell the story of how we get to the final bit now.
[00:43:34] Claire: How, how do we get [00:43:35] to?
[00:43:35] Lily: Is it phantom? Where you
[00:43:36] Claire: are? I think, I think, well you tell me. Is there anything else in between?
[00:43:39] Lily: [00:43:40] Yeah, um, so I [00:43:45] auditioned three times for Phantom, three different times, um, throughout a [00:43:50] year, over like two years or a year and a half, um, [00:43:55] it, it's a journey, um, and [00:44:00] um, I auditioned first for Carver Christine.
[00:44:03] Lily: I went [00:44:05] through, I think I've Yeah, I've done the finals, uh, didn't get it, [00:44:10] um, because they were like, we want to see you later on for alternate or [00:44:15] main. Christine, I was like, oh, okay, that's nice. So I waited a bit more, did [00:44:20] another audition, um, and went to the finals. [00:44:25] Didn't get it. This time was pretty hard.
[00:44:27] Lily: Um, and, [00:44:30] um, and then a little personal thing happened. So [00:44:35] I, I had a choice to choose my. [00:44:40] career or this. Very weird because it was a moment where I got [00:44:45] a no from, from a very important audition for me. [00:44:50] And I had this choice as well. And I was like, is that a sign? Is that, you know, and [00:44:55] I was like, no, I. I need to hope to choose [00:45:00] my career and to actually actively make a choice [00:45:05] of I'm going to focus on that opened so many doors and I started to audition for a lot of things [00:45:10] and I re auditioned for Phantom.
[00:45:14] Lily: Um, [00:45:15] around after the new year, uh, the last time, and it was [00:45:20] a long process, did my first audition beginning of March, got a yes, [00:45:25] 17th of June, was a long process. [00:45:30] Um, but this process, I was like, my mindset was a bit [00:45:35] different because I was like, If it's not meant to be, [00:45:40] meant to be now, it's never gonna, it's never gonna work.
[00:45:43] Lily: So I kind of let go of [00:45:45] something. Um, and, and so I got it This [00:45:50] time around it's been a bit crazy in a great, in a great way. [00:45:55] I think it opened something in me to be like, 'cause I was [00:46:00] struggling. It was like I just got a no from a big audition. A lot of [00:46:05] nos from other auditions. And I was like, where am I going?
[00:46:09] Lily: What's [00:46:10] happening? What three years? Like, I, I need money. I need to pay my bills. I [00:46:15] need, I want to perform. Like, I was very frustrated. There was a lot of [00:46:20] frustration. And just to actively say, at the moment, this is the most important thing [00:46:25] in my life. It's kind of like remaking that promise to myself, [00:46:30] which gave me a lot of strengths and strength.
[00:46:33] Lily: Sorry. And a lot of [00:46:35] like, I think in the audition room is like, I know I'm [00:46:40] made for that. I'm, you know, I, I, I belong here and I [00:46:45] actively made that choice, you know, and I, I had like two paths [00:46:50] and I was like, this is this one. I'm not going to give up. And I think [00:46:55] that energy kind of released a lot of confidence or [00:47:00] trust into the future.
[00:47:01] Lily: And I do believe that in the room. They feel that. [00:47:05]
[00:47:05] Claire: Yes.
[00:47:05] Lily: They feel that I've got absolutely nothing to lose. I've been through so [00:47:10] much emotionally, you know, with lemmings and all of that. I've got [00:47:15] absolutely nothing to lose. A no is not gonna [00:47:20] stop me anymore. I think energetically maybe opened some doors. I [00:47:25] don't know what happened.
[00:47:25] Lily: I didn't do anything. Because I had a screen [00:47:30] job right after that. I booked a job. After three years and I was like, [00:47:35] What? It's incredible. It's very weird.
[00:47:39] Oren: What does [00:47:40] Christine mean to you?
[00:47:41] Lily: It means [00:47:45] definitely achievement because in this industry, Christine is [00:47:50] one of the biggest role you can do as a soprano.
[00:47:53] Lily: At first, [00:47:55] everybody's like, Oh, you should play Christine, you're a soprano. You look like Christine. [00:48:00] Um, but it's not as easy. I started to work on the role [00:48:05] technically five years before I auditioned. [00:48:10] Um, because I knew that this would be something that would be seen [00:48:15] for, especially after doing Cosette. I think Liam is, I see that as like, [00:48:20] Oh, I got a bit lucky, Christine, I wasn't lucky.
[00:48:23] Lily: I worked so [00:48:25] freaking hard to get it, whether it's emotionally, technically, physically, all of it. [00:48:30] I, it's my, it's my victory. No one can take that [00:48:35] away from me. So it's very, it's a very personal comeback, I think. [00:48:40] So it means a lot in terms of, I think it means, [00:48:45] um, actually it's worth it. [00:48:50] You know, that's why I worked so hard.
[00:48:53] Lily: Um, [00:48:55] and it's a really suited role for me because I never leave the stage. I don't have time to [00:49:00] think. I don't have time to be anxious. I don't have time to do all of that. So. [00:49:05] Because I always need a challenge. I think cause I got a bit bored and that's [00:49:10] where my brain. Yeah is wondering. Yeah, it's doing Christine I'm like [00:49:15] I still have so much to learn vocally on it.
[00:49:17] Lily: I'm still every day working on [00:49:20] Oh that topsy was a bit shit. I need to I'll have the second show [00:49:25] today to try something different and I never say to myself Oh, you can't do it. [00:49:30] I'm just saying, oh, tomorrow you have the opportunity to try again and actually find new things. [00:49:35] And that's why it suited for me because it challenges me in every way.
[00:49:39] Lily: Um, [00:49:40] and my brain is focused on that and not on what people think in the audience. [00:49:45] Um, so it's very freeing, I think. Yeah.
[00:49:48] Claire: How was that on the first day of rehearsal? [00:49:50]
[00:49:51] Lily: Oh, it was so the first, [00:49:55] the actual first day where we met everyone. It also I'm playing with John Robbins [00:50:00] again. I speak about him all the time, but it was so immense.
[00:50:03] Lily: It meant so much. We [00:50:05] had a long chat with applause for thought. Um, um, so [00:50:10] we talked about mental health and all that. That was really good. Um, but the actual first [00:50:15] day of rehearsal where we did something, um, I just didn't [00:50:20] want to leave. I didn't want to go home. I was like, This is my playground. I can, I can [00:50:25] stay
[00:50:25] Claire: all day.
[00:50:25] Claire: It's very different to the first day of limits.
[00:50:28] Oren: Yeah, it is. But it also, [00:50:30] again, reminds me of when, how you were saying earlier about you were always the last one to leave and you were doing your [00:50:35] stretches when you were training and all this kind of stuff. It seems like this is, This was you. [00:50:40] Yes,
[00:50:40] Lily: because I'm very disciplined.
[00:50:42] Lily: Coming from a gymnastic background, doing championships, [00:50:45] it's, it's, you, you learn discipline. And first, I see, I see it as a [00:50:50] sport. A competitive sport, but with yourself. [00:50:55] Um, not with others. Absolutely not. You can't compare. It's different in that, in that sense. But [00:51:00] in the way I work, my brain is wired to be, um, an [00:51:05] athlete.
[00:51:05] Lily: Um, because I was. And so the discipline [00:51:10] of it, there's, there's also bad things about being, not being good enough [00:51:15] and all of that. And that's different, but it's, it's just to [00:51:20] always find, to always push further. [00:51:25] And. I think I found a good, positive balance on [00:51:30] that, to not be like, pushing further for the wrong reasons.
[00:51:33] Lily: Cause you know, you need to feel like you're good [00:51:35] enough at your, and accept that sometimes, you're, it's, it's not a [00:51:40] great show that you're doing. Um, and now I'm fine with that, thanks to you actually, [00:51:45] since we've been working together, working on, so I came to you. [00:51:50] Because of my perfectionism and my perfectionism is so the pressure I put [00:51:55] on myself is so much that it was affecting my performance and now [00:52:00] with Christine because I feel like it's mine in terms of like not compared to [00:52:05] anybody else but because it's it's it was my fight for so long that now I'm like there's no [00:52:10] way I'm gonna let it I don't want to go into a negative kind of, you know, [00:52:15] putting pressure on myself too much.
[00:52:16] Lily: It's, you know, I'm just trying to do my job for other [00:52:20] people, but the work that I do in terms of what I want to achieve in the role, [00:52:25] artistically, vocally, I'm staying at the end of rehearsals because I love [00:52:30] it. Not to prove anything, just because I love it. So, [00:52:35] and it's, it's a big part of me. It's a big part of me.[00:52:40]
[00:52:40] Claire: You mentioned. Dealing with performance anxiety things at the [00:52:45] moment. Is that something? Yeah. So recently, weirdly, I've been
[00:52:47] Lily: forgetting lyrics all the time. [00:52:50] Um, so I started Phantom and my personal [00:52:55] life changed completely. I split up with my partner [00:53:00] and so everything kind of went, you know, so my [00:53:05] work life is extraordinary.
[00:53:06] Lily: I'm having, you know, an amazing time, but at the same time I'm dealing with [00:53:10] personal things and Christine is taking your whole life.
[00:53:14] Claire: Yeah.
[00:53:14] Lily: It's, it's [00:53:15] a lot of, it's, it's a lot of work. It's a lot of preparation. It's a lot of, and also when I enjoy [00:53:20] something, I just want to not in a healthy way be [00:53:25] busy. Um, so I've been dealing for the first time with [00:53:30] anxiety and sleeping issues and all of that, and [00:53:35] to do my job I need to be able to be strong enough, because I'm [00:53:40] leading a show, um, and so I've been working on that, [00:53:45] but I've weirdly, I've always felt that being on stage was [00:53:50] always a good, like a safe place.
[00:53:54] Lily: But sometimes, [00:53:55] some weeks, I have moments of like, what's happening? [00:54:00] And at this, when I, when I see that, I'm like, I need, there's something I need to change. [00:54:05] But I'm not beating myself up about it. Which I think is the difference.
[00:54:09] Claire: Yeah.
[00:54:09] Lily: [00:54:10] Um, because sometimes it can bring a lot of frustration. You're like, no, I need to be able to do my job.
[00:54:14] Lily: Why can't I need [00:54:15] to, you know, but because I've been consistent with the role and I've been, [00:54:20] um, I think doing a good job, I'm trying to put the pressure [00:54:25] off and be like, it's normal to feel, you can feel anxious while being [00:54:30] happy. And I think what I'm learning now is you can be happy and unhappy at the same time.[00:54:35]
[00:54:35] Lily: Um, Which is weird, but it's interesting. It's [00:54:40] very interesting.
[00:54:40] Claire: Yeah, I think there is a perception that we, we feel one emotion at the time and I think [00:54:45] that's nonsense. Yeah. I think we exist on, in many [00:54:50] states at any given time, given on the, given the context we're in at that point. [00:54:55] Um, and I think if you're in a workplace and that's completely [00:55:00] absorbing you, it is possible to put those other things down for a while, which actually [00:55:05] in that instance maybe makes that really healthy.
[00:55:07] Claire: Yeah. So long as you're not [00:55:10] constantly running away from the other thing, you know, to give yourself rest from it. What I'm trying [00:55:15] to
[00:55:15] Lily: work out. As well is to remember that it's a workplace. It's not just, it's, it [00:55:20] is a bit, it is a bit therapeutic, but that's personal, that you keep that to yourself, right?
[00:55:24] Lily: [00:55:25] Yeah. You don't want to bring that to your company office. What I'm accepting now is that my [00:55:30] job is me. And that's unhealthy, I know that. But [00:55:35] accepting it is healthy because It has been a [00:55:40] goal since I was 13. This has been every day on my mind. [00:55:45] You know, how can I be like, yeah, this is my job, but I have my life.
[00:55:49] Lily: No, [00:55:50] my life is my job. I've been focused on it since I was 13 [00:55:55] and I've apologized to myself now for feeling frustrated about this [00:56:00] because I'm like. No, Lily, you, this, this was your biggest dream and you've, [00:56:05] you're achieving it now. It's okay to feel that everything is mixed up, you'll find [00:56:10] the balance, but your job is you.
[00:56:12] Lily: It's a big part of you, you [00:56:15] know? Um, I moved to London for work. This is where I'm happy, so [00:56:20] it is a part of me. Yeah. I don't have any. I [00:56:25] do, but like tiny things. I don't, some people, I love the people that are like, yeah, do crochet. I [00:56:30] do this. And on my free time, it's like my free time. I sing. I, I [00:56:35] work on my straw.
[00:56:35] Lily: I work on whatever, you know, I do secret sing. [00:56:40] Um, so it's, It's, it's, yeah, it's, it's [00:56:45] unbalanced, but beautifully unbalanced as well, I think.
[00:56:48] Claire: You mentioned this [00:56:50] is it, you've achieved it. So do you have a notion about what comes [00:56:55] next?
[00:56:55] Lily: Recently, there's something that is new. There's a new [00:57:00] feeling in me. Before, I've always been, you know, I can get bored very [00:57:05] easily.
[00:57:05] Lily: I always need more. It's never enough for me in terms of challenge. I need to. push to [00:57:10] pursue that dream and it's the first time that I feel like I've landed somewhere. [00:57:15] Now I have the stability and I'm I don't feel the [00:57:20] need to fulfill that non enoughness in terms of, you know, I'm like, oh, now [00:57:25] I can, I can focus on me.
[00:57:27] Lily: I feel, I feel challenged [00:57:30] enough. I feel happy enough in my job. I don't have the, [00:57:35] the, um, the need to put something else on my CV. [00:57:40] I don't have the need to prove anything to myself. I don't [00:57:45] care, which is very weird because my brain is like, [00:57:50] what's happening? You're not running anymore. You know, it's, it's, and now that I feel, [00:57:55] oh, I have a stable job where I feel happy.
[00:57:59] Lily: I can [00:58:00] rest. You know what I mean? Yeah. I can, I can just, I can [00:58:05] just breathe. And the thing that I wrote recently in my journal [00:58:10] about my little self and the achievement, the achievement that I've. I feel like [00:58:15] accomplished. It's like, it's my 13 year old self [00:58:20] being like, you've done it, you can, you can, you can rest now, you've [00:58:25] done it, you can have a breather before the next, the next dream, you know, [00:58:30] and it's so, it's very weird, it's very [00:58:35] weird, but it's so freeing, because it's that feeling [00:58:40] of, I don't need to prove anything to myself or to any other people, [00:58:45] because it's, yeah, yeah.
[00:58:48] Lily: I've, I've, and I'm continuing [00:58:50] to work on, you know, singing lessons and I do cabarets and I do [00:58:55] concerts, but that's for, that's because I, I always need to, to do [00:59:00] new things. I'm looking artistically to new ways to, to improve because for me it's, [00:59:05] it's, if I don't learn anything new in a job, that's where there's a problem.
[00:59:09] Lily: And [00:59:10] that's where I'd be like, I need, I need to move on. Actually, my next goal [00:59:15] while doing Phantom would be to dance again. So that's another dream, but it's for me, [00:59:20] it's not for, well, I guess it's useful for auditions, but it's more like to reconnect [00:59:25] to how it started as it's still going, [00:59:30]
[00:59:30] Claire: you know, it's glorious.
[00:59:32] Lily: It's amazing. It's all worth [00:59:35] it. I'm glad that, yeah, it's amazing.
[00:59:38] Claire: Lily, thank you so much for [00:59:40] sharing so generously of your experience. Telling us your wonderful [00:59:45] story. We're not actually done with you quite yet because this is the five minute call. [00:59:50] So we would love to know what do you do at the five minute call?[00:59:55]
[00:59:55] Lily: I'm going to be honest, at the moment, I don't do a lot. I just don't [01:00:00] do anything. I I go to the bathroom. I [01:00:05] get changed. I, I, um, I chat with my [01:00:10] dresser. I take the pressure off. I don't, I have time before the beginning of the [01:00:15] show before I go on stage to center myself. Um, [01:00:20] I usually, I decide I do my makeup not too early [01:00:25] because I don't want to have too much time before the show.
[01:00:28] Lily: It needs to flow. It needs to, [01:00:30] if I have time to think, be like, okay, I'm going to do phantom now. That's when my brain's [01:00:35] like, oh, um, so I, usually the moment where [01:00:40] I focus is, uh, during the first scene, the auctioneer scene, before [01:00:45] the overture, I just, I just go, I just go in the staircase and I [01:00:50] breathe and I check in with my voice, um, [01:00:55] but I see, I see some, you know, the same people at the same time, those kind of [01:01:00] rituals, but at the five minute call, I, [01:01:05] I relax.
[01:01:06] Lily: I honestly, I try to, I try to not be focused too [01:01:10] soon because it's tiring. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. For this role to. [01:01:15] Because I think this role is so hard for focusing. It's hard vocally, but it's the [01:01:20] focus. So I try to, um, to relax and [01:01:25] to still be connected to myself. I don't look at my phone. I don't like social media.
[01:01:29] Lily: [01:01:30] I try to not put too much thought, too many thoughts in my head. Because then that's why I'm a bit [01:01:35] distracted.
[01:01:35] Claire: So
[01:01:36] Lily: I try to And meditation music sometimes. [01:01:40] Ascension oil. Oh,
[01:01:41] Claire: sounds heavenly. Can I come sit in your dressing room? Yeah, it's actually very, [01:01:45] it's actually very chill. Like, it's very Anyone needs a chill zone in London?
[01:01:49] Claire: Oh, all the [01:01:50] wiggies, you
[01:01:51] Lily: know, the wiggies, the, the, the, my dresser, were quite like [01:01:55] Chill, put the, you know, the wig on, how are you doing? How was your Sunday? It's very, it's very [01:02:00] much like that. And then, let's do
[01:02:01] Claire: the show. Think of me. Let's do it. [01:02:05] Yeah. Yeah. Amazing. Okay. Thank you. We have
[01:02:08] Oren: We have one [01:02:10] tradition on this podcast.
[01:02:12] Oren: Where we get the guest [01:02:15] of the previous episode to write a question.
[01:02:17] Lily: Ooh.
[01:02:18] Oren: For you. Or for the new guest. [01:02:20] Wow. Well, I'll just read it, otherwise I'm just Okay. Yeah. Is [01:02:25] theatre relevant in the modern world?
[01:02:27] Announcer: Wow![01:02:30]
[01:02:33] Claire: Just a little thing [01:02:35] to conjure with.
[01:02:36] Oren: You know, just to talk about the end of it. Wow! Is [01:02:40] theatre relevant in the modern world?
[01:02:42] Lily: Yeah, I think so. [01:02:45] Um, I think It's hard because being in [01:02:50] the industry, it's just, it's your world. So I'm trying to put myself into like a, [01:02:55] a person that's not in that world. It's very hard not to immediately go,
[01:02:59] Claire: I'm defending [01:03:00] it because, yeah.
[01:03:02] Lily: Theatre can make you think, can make you laugh, [01:03:05] can make you cry. It just makes you feel and you can identify yourself [01:03:10] into certain characters or stories. Um, it's. It's, [01:03:15] for me, it's creating a world. You have so many different [01:03:20] styles and genres of theatre. I think it's to [01:03:25] be able to open yourself [01:03:30] up to stories, um, and to escape, [01:03:35] definitely.
[01:03:35] Lily: To escape for two, three hours. And I, it's hard. Because [01:03:40] we're not saving lives, like we said. [01:03:45] But sometimes we do. No, but
[01:03:46] Claire: I would add. Sometimes
[01:03:47] Lily: we do.
[01:03:48] Claire: To, I think, [01:03:50] To add to what you've said, which I completely agree with. I think there is a really key [01:03:55] element with theatre, which is that it is in real life, in person.[01:04:00]
[01:04:00] Claire: And in this day and age, where we are all digitally connected to one another, but [01:04:05] not necessarily physically and, you know, in the same space. I think to go and hear those [01:04:10] stories, because, you know, I love television, I love film, I adore being [01:04:15] told a story in any format. But when you are there, live, in [01:04:20] person, there is a different energy.
[01:04:22] Claire: And you are sharing it with people. Hundreds [01:04:25] of other people who all chose to come and see that thing as well. I actually got really, um, I got really [01:04:30] emotional at the pantomime this year. Listen, I always get emotional on the Overture [01:04:35] to anything, but, um, Phantom's the worst. Um, cry [01:04:40] every time. But, uh. Yeah, I was sat at the Palladium and [01:04:45] just looking around all these people who came from so many walks [01:04:50] of life.
[01:04:52] Claire: But I imagined that some of them, [01:04:55] maybe that's their one theatre trip every year, right? Yeah. But the point was, it [01:05:00] was like, and I was talking about this with a friend of mine. It's like church. It's like everybody [01:05:05] gathers together to do one thing and experience it together.
[01:05:09] Lily: I agree. I think also it's [01:05:10] out of reach.
[01:05:10] Lily: It's, they, it's real. It's, it's, you see it live. [01:05:15] Yes. You see the people on stage. You see. You know, it's, it's different from screen [01:05:20] definitely. It's, it's, it's accessible. It's something that's the closest you [01:05:25] can get to the art.
[01:05:27] Claire: And
[01:05:27] Lily: like, you know, and to [01:05:30] almost touching, sometimes touching, you know, with the immersive guys and dolls now.
[01:05:33] Lily: It's just, you're [01:05:35] in, it's just. It's a very different experience from [01:05:40] screen, definitely.
[01:05:40] Oren: No, I was going to say that fundamentally I agree with everything. But I also think [01:05:45] theatre has and always will have the very unique ability to [01:05:50] highlight things that are happening in the world or in history and [01:05:55] make, bring them to the forefront to get people thinking about them.
[01:05:58] Oren: And I think that's a really important [01:06:00] role, not just for that escapism aspect, but to To think about [01:06:05] stuff that is
[01:06:07] Lily: important and happening
[01:06:08] Oren: and relevant.
[01:06:09] Lily: And it's [01:06:10] representing the society as well. And now we're doing a better job with [01:06:15] diversity and all of that. And it's, it's a long process at the moment.
[01:06:18] Lily: It's, and I think it's so [01:06:20] important to people to see, like it's, [01:06:25] it's, it's a way to see the world we're living in as well. Um, [01:06:30] I think we're doing better with that, but it's a representation of. [01:06:35] Mm hmm.
[01:06:37] Claire: And my final thought on this [01:06:40] is coming back to your, you know, forgotten lyric or whatever. Everything [01:06:45] we are.
[01:06:45] Claire: Watching on TV or listening to on the radio or anything has been [01:06:50] tweezed and perfected
[01:06:52] Lily: and
[01:06:53] Claire: blurred and [01:06:55] actually to be in the presence of something that is happening in real time and has mistakes in it, I think [01:07:00] is reassuringly human.
[01:07:01] Lily: It's beautiful. I love when I see actors laugh on [01:07:05] stage. Yeah. Because they're like, Oh, you're real.
[01:07:07] Lily: Yeah. You are [01:07:10] real. Yeah. Amazing.
[01:07:13] Claire: Well, thank you to that question writer. [01:07:15] Well, yeah, I can't actually remember who it was. We're going to invite you to write the question in a minute, but we'll do that off camera. Okay, amazing.
[01:07:19] Lily: Thank you so much for [01:07:20] having me. Thank
[01:07:21] Oren: you so much.
[01:07:22] Lily: [01:07:25] Next
[01:07:25] Oren: Monday on The 5 Minute Call.
[01:07:28] Announcer: There was this expectation that this [01:07:30] person would sort out. a blue light ambulance call who's coming at two in the morning on their own and you're 24, [01:07:35] 25 at the time thinking Oh my god, what is happening?[01:07:40]
[01:07:43] Claire: In this episode we're [01:07:45] talking to Dr. Martin Sawiris.
[01:07:46] Oren: Dr Martin is a member of the Royal College of General Practice and [01:07:50] holds a Bachelor of Medicine and a Bachelor of Surgery and talks to us about life[01:07:55]
[01:07:57] Announcer: I don't know how somebody who's doing eight shows [01:08:00] a week, sometimes they are utterly exhausted. But that drive to not take [01:08:05] a break, the thing I worry about from that perspective is getting burnt out. I remember I got a phone [01:08:10] call one day, he needed somebody to look after his company. I said, wow, [01:08:15] sounds incredible, who's this?
[01:08:16] Announcer: He said, well it's Cameron McIntosh.[01:08:20]
[01:08:23] Claire: We hope you enjoyed this [01:08:25] episode of The 5 Minute Call. Don't forget to hit that subscribe button, like this video and [01:08:30] ring the bell for notifications. Your support really does help us bring you more amazing [01:08:35] stories.
[01:08:36] Oren: If you are or have been affected by any of the topics discussed in this [01:08:40] episode, please see the show notes below for some helpful [01:08:45] resources.